What would you do?

[snoopy]

we have a pm like that too. She's so bossy if we aren't getting our way we sometimes sick her on people.
 
But seriously, she was meddling in so many projects that where possible - i.e. where someone sent a job to us directly without her knowledge - we just froze her out completely. She was pissing off everybody, the designers, the writers, etc. And if the project involved her, we'd just do whatever she wanted to get it out the door.
 
This method seems to be working for us.

[cpaw1122]

I'm a creative manager myself, and I've had this happen to me personally while working where I am as well as to the designers on the team.

I think the main thing to keep in mind is that the client is your client. Teamwork, back and forth communication must happen. What often can happen is the client may say something like: "Change the color of that text to red." What frustrates me is simply doing it without finding out WHY. Perhaps they wanted the text to stand out. Red isn't in the color scheme for the piece. So, it's teamwork--presenting different alternatives...maybe it's making it knock out of a solid color that is within the scheme, or making the text slightly larger, but not changing the color.

The underlying theme here is: communication, teamwork and compromise! You'll never be able to tell a client a flat out "no" (unless it totally does not fall within branding standards), and the client should never tell you a "must" if it's regarding good design that needs to be subjectivly tweaked for their own preference.

That's my two cents...

[rapture]

Adding to what's been said, from a CD and designer point of view you need to pick and choose your battles too. Yes, having a client say "change that color to red" may not make any sense, and the designer in us may rebel, but if changing the color to red doesn't destroy your design or ruin the integrity of what you're doing than maybe it's not something you need to raise a stink about. You can't win em all, and by elevating everything the client brings up (justifiable or not) can saturate the potentess of any other future discussions where you might want to take a really strong stance on.

[LoganBlade]

Document Document Document.
Save a PDF of your job in original design form that has been praised by the intelegent people. Then if the redesigns cause the marketing to go south or not produce expected results you can always say the peron with no intelegent design skills made changes cause they are crazy and you can show them what it was supposed to look like.
 
I am sure this is done but sometimes by the wrong people. Ask the customer the goals of the piece and color schemes and such. If your not that person asking then the second hand information is probably getting distorted some how. When I do work for someone I wil do as the say then change color schemes to better colors and send as additional samples. Most cases this takes little time if planeed correctly. A couple etra save and mutlpe chooses. Some times they just want more to choos from because they dont like to say yes right away. This works well for me because I have less to do when they ask for changes

[2aminPhoenix]

cpaw1122, you're dead-on. If any changes in design are made, you'd better have a good reason.

A. Because that's what market analysis testing says works
B. Because that's what better fits the band

Not because it looks "cool", or because that's how --- does it.

There has to be an effective approval system in place, but there will always be problems.

If I ask someone why changes were or had to be made, I want to know why? If you can't give me a good enough reason, then that reason is not good enough.

[inhouseGuy]

I am a member of an average size in-house group for a larger company. Our organization is flat, there is no real career "path" in terms of someone being designated as senior over another member because we all work under one manager. It becomes challenging when working with people who have less experience than I have (I've been a designer for over 8 years now) because we like to all say we're all a part of one team. So, while technically I might have the same amount of experience as an art director or senior designer at other companies, it is not reflected in our culture or in our day-to-day working relationships. It all lends itself to a lot of tip-toeing around things and each other, and it adds a lot of confusion to the workload.

I am currently training a new person to work within our style guide (an unpublished guide, nothing official other than the body of work we have to date). The problem is that she doesn't have any layout skills, or, based upon what I've seen of her portfolio, she doesn't apply her knowledge here at work. It's rather annoying.

I've already helped her a lot on various projects, but I wonder if this was the wrong decision? Basically, I am art directing every piece of work she does, and she's not picking up a bit of knowledge to apply to her own work, and I don't really have any authority to work with her like I would if it was a senior designer working with a junior designer. All of this help is beginning to impact the amount of time I can commit to my own projects. I've lightly suggested that she sketch ideas before diving onto the computer, researching things more, and just doing more WORK other than showing me the first thing she creates. I see skill in the things she does freelancing, but don't know how to draw it out of her for her daily work.

I am on the verge of just telling her not to bother asking my opinion until she has 5-10 ideas to discuss with at least one of them having any hierarchical sense to the content she is trying to present on the page. I want to pull the "grumpy design instructor" on her, but don't think I can at this point. I've heard stories of people working for CDs who constantly just ask "so, is this the best solution you could come up with?" of any work presented. I think that can be a valid question if it isn't said in an arrogant way.

So, what do I do? Any tips?

[phoenix]

I feel for you! A few random thoughts, potentially not articulated as well as I would like given more time!

- can you approach your manager with your concerns - either as a 'I deserve a raise because I am bearing more responsibility' or as a 'I'm not sure this person can do the job they were hired to do given these points'?

- did you manager hire her? Did somebody who understands design / this position's role sit in on her interview? If not, perhaps she's pulled a swifty?

I once interviewed a girl who cold-called for a job, and she had a nice portfolio, very nice work. As we were a little swamped at the time, I suggested she come in for a day's paid freelancing to see if she liked us, we liked her, and with a view to taking some of our overflow in the short term.

I sat with her and talked through her portfolio... but when it came to sitting at the computer and creating work it became screamingly obvious that she must have lied, and the portfolio work was not hers. There was such a disconnect between what was presented and what she was able to do (both concepting ideas, and actually using the programs to execute those ideas).

She was such a nice girl, but she'd been looking for a job for two or so years and I think desperation got to her. She must have figured that if she at least got her foot in the door via 'her' portfolio, she'd be able to fudge her way through the position, getting help and learning.

The problem is that she doesn't have any layout skills, or, based upon what I've seen of her portfolio, she doesn't apply her knowledge here at work.

I wonder if your person is a bit the same, from what you've said?

[dhorrocks]

I agree with phoenix member @ 150dpi. Address the issue with the hire-ups. With as fast-paced as this world is, sometimes you need to stop everything, go to a room, and address any issues and really discuss stuff. If you didn't do the hiring then reporting on the new-hire's performance to the person who did may be in order. Do all this with the problem-solving attitude so no one is defensive or frustrated. But if people need to know, then say something.

In our last art dept. meeting with our dept. /Head C.O.O., he told us in detail what he needed from us for a specific ***...he defined anything that was cloudy and we asked questions. If people are afraid of offending then perhaps you could voice the issues by saying, "have we considered this" or "I think this is an issue and here is why". OH! and think about what you're going to say before going into a meeting. It helps a lot. If others know your concerns and the positive results if things are addressed effectively, it could improve practices. It's challenging I know.

I've worked in-house for an eLearning company for 14 years. For me visual challenges abound where creatives don't have the final say. And when other fellow artists/graphic designers are disenchanted and apathetic and you feel like you're the only one who cares?......it's tough...but it's worth trying to make things better....and there are successes along the way.

Be in her corner. Encouragement. insight, optimism, explanations, defining the problem, voicing expectations of final outcome, sharing the vision....that kind of attitude can go a long way to get what you need. Constructive criticism is so important. "may I make a suggestion?" or "it's almost there" or "it's not quite there yet" My superiors keep things on a non-emotional judgemental level. They'll sandwich praise with what is needed or how they want it to be improved.

If the person is just showing you the first thing then maybe say, "would you draw out some options?" or "try exploring it more". If she isn't applying her freelance skills to her work then tell her, "I love what you did for (such-n-such). How did you come up with that solution? It really works well! Why don't you try that approach or process for this ***/client?" Or ask them how they came up with the finished piece. Perhaps they need to find something they love in the project. She needs to find a way to invest interest into the project. Taking a walk or brainstorming might do that.

--Don't be the "grumpy design instructor" but the "design Co-hort ON FIRE". This may be new territory for her so some advice and passion may help to loosen up things.

[inhouseGuy]

- can you approach your manager with your concerns - either as a 'I deserve a raise because I am bearing more responsibility' or as a 'I'm not sure this person can do the job they were hired to do given these points'?

- did you manager hire her? Did somebody who understands design / this position's role sit in on her interview? If not, perhaps she's pulled a swifty?

Thank you, phoenix.

Our manager hired her, and our manager is not a designer. In fact, she was hired without any of the design team even meeting her. I am definitely not saying we wouldn't have hired her, but we could have at least voiced some concerns at that point. I plan to speak to my manager about this situation soon. For the time being, I have backed off of providing my co-worker with solutions. Instead, I am simply posing questions to force her to begin exploring things on her own. I don't want to be too optimistic, but it seems to be working.

I think she does have some layout skills buried deeply somewhere. Now I'm wondering if her instructors didn't just play the art director role and tell her explicitly what to try instead of forcing her to explore things on her own. I've had instructors who were like that.

[inhouseGuy]

ORIGINAL: dhorrocks

Do all this with the problem-solving attitude so no one is defensive or frustrated. But if people need to know, then say something.

Thanks, since my post, which I now see was quite a bit of venting, I've taken a step back and I've started posing questions to her instead of providing a solution.

I appreciate your suggestions. I've started applying them, and it's making a difference. I do plan on speaking to my manager to see if there is any possibility of structuring the workload in such a way that our entire team can support her, and delegate appropriate work to her since my manager does not have a clear understanding of her true skill.

We'll see how it all goes!